Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 00:13:10 -0500
From: "ESCO automatic digest system" <LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU>
Subject: ESCO Digest - 27 Mar 2007 to 3 Apr 2007 (#2007-33)

There are 5 messages totalling 503 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:
1. Growth hormone
2. 20x20 molars
3. Open bite retention
4. Extending the class II discussion onto anterior torque
5. Re: Finishing with Class II molars


Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 09:45:58 -0400
From: "charles ruff" <orthodmd@MAC.COM>
Subject: growth hormone

I have a 12 year old female patient who is very short statured (4 ft 8 in?). She feels it makes her look 3 years younger than her friends of the same age. Her parents are considering growth hormone to help her growth and are wondering what effect this might have on the size of her jaws and whether it might help relieve crowding. She has a vertical pattern (32 degrees PP MP), and since I don't do Damon :-) , I am considering all 5s both for a slight class II problem and significant lower crowding. Any ideas or comments on the growth hormone issue?

charlie ruff


Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 15:51:10 -0400
From: "charles ruff" <orthodmd@MAC.COM>
Subject: 20x20 molars

can you tell us a little more about the 20x20 molars.  are these from GAC?  Are they the ones Roncone uses?  Do you normally use bands or bonds.  If bond,s I find that they debond fairly easily because they are more bulky than regular molar bonds.

charlie ruff


Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 07:56:50 -0400
From: "charles ruff" <orthodmd@MAC.COM>
Subject: open bite retention

I am finishing an openbite adult tx plan that involved the extraction of four bis for profile reasons. Openbite was closed with max miniplates and mand miniscrews. Does anyone out there have a special retention protocol for open bites?

charlie ruff


Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 16:11:32 +0530
From: "Dr. M.Jayaram" <jmailankody@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Extending the class II discussion onto anterior torque

Hullo Group,                 

It is good to note that the profession is waking up from the initial fanatism of prescription mania. Discussion on molar tubes for Class II and Class III(Torque and Offset) in the preceding issues was thought-provoking and refreshing.                

Coming to the anterior torque, isn't it necessary to have different torques for upper and lower anteriors in class II cases(Skeletal Base). The upper anteriors need to be finished more upright and lowers more procumbent. (unless, of course, one is decompensating for surgery.) This will call for a minimum or no/negative(0-10 degrees) torque in the upper anterior and extra torque(10 to 15 degrees)in the lower anterior brackets.                

Similarly, class III would require more torque(20-30 degrees)on upper anterior brackets for compensation, and lowers would call for a negative(minus 10 to minus 25 degrees) to compensate for skeletal base abnormality, in non-surgical orthodontic treatment plan. Of course one has to make adequate margin for ply and incomplete expression of the built-in torque. It would also be interesting to note that subdivisions would require different tip on left and right side, particularly if  3 teeth extraction option is carried out.                                

These issues need further discussion and debate. One thing is certain, it may be easy to under-express the torque, but negating the built in torque/tip in a prescription bracket calls for an uphill, if not impossible, task. It is hoped that with vast intellectual resource at the ESCO, undaunted by pressures of commerce('One prescription to fit all faces/problems?) will definitely make the mind 'rule the roost', than the prescription ruling the mind!

Jayaram Mailankody,
Calicut, INDIA.


Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2007 23:01:14 -0400
From: smilemakr@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Finishing with Class II molars


I agree that 0 degree offset for Class II molar finish is ideal (and is what Roth taught), and have been using the 14 torque/0 offset tubes from 'A' Company for many years.  I agree that 20 torque/0 offset would be better, to avoid hanging lingual cusps when mainly using 19x25 wire (I recently began using 20 torque/14 offset from GAC for Class I finishes--tried 20 torque/20 offset Roncone Rx tubes from GAC, but felt the distal aspect of the molars was getting thrown too far lingually ).  Where do you get your 20 torque/0 offset tubes?

Mark Joiner
Santa Cruz, CA